Budgeting and venue screw up
Erin Jeavons-Fellows
Public
Seen by 72
Anomalie sent an email on the 31st July listing 5 points of the conditions of our agreement.
1. You would be hosting your own bars and drinks.
2. Decoration is possible and there are storage facilities
3. You could decorate also a day before if necessary and if there is no corporate event. Otherwise Friday 11 am is fine to start and Saturday Midday is fine to finish.
4. You can bring the food you like for your crew.
5. About the door cut. Would 60/40 work for you? and if attendance is over 1200 we do 70/30 ? In your favour?
Today they came back and changed the agreement listing
1. Bars
If you choose the door split option there is no possibility to host your own bar. That would only be possible if you rent the whole club since the club has to cover all the costs otherwise.
2. Deco setup and take down times are ok.
3. Own food would be ok
4. Door cut: 60/40 and 70/30 (if attendance is over 1200) is a really generous offer I put on the table. Usually it's 50/50. But let's go with it and make it work for everybody.
Basically if we want a no commerce event, we need to pay 12k, but we can keep the money to cover this and use the rest for dreams. Thing is, we could go in the red if we don't get 1000 people through the door. So I'm less inclined to agree we go for this. If we choose the 60/40 option, we need to have a commerce event. We have already agreed this isn't a fundraiser. We don't want to make money on this event and we want to keep it a reasonable price.
This thread is brainstorm ways we can explore having a no commerce event or work out a way we can work with Anomalie or we will have to change venues and figure out another plan.
Cris Fri 23 Aug 2019 3:18PM
After talking so much about the BYO concept, I'm sure I'm not the only one who wont go fo anything else... :)
Also very much into the pre-sales and sliding scale ideas! I'd push for a low income ticket of 10-15€ at max. The kind of events I (and most of the ppl I know) go to are never over that amount and either you are indeed allow to bring drinks from the outside or they cost 1,50-2€. Just to put a bit of perspective on the inclusion topic.
Early-bird tickets could be 15-20€ and the normal 20-25€.
And what could be the distribution of them? Maybe around 200 low income tickets - 300 early bird ones - 500+ normal? (20%-30%-50%) More suggestions?
Btw, I already reached to @kris to help them out with the ticketing, so we can have the pre-sale. More news after BM..
Another thing: I know the focus and goal is to get enough ppl there, but, is there a maximum amount that Gate should be aware of?
britzmaster Fri 23 Aug 2019 3:54PM
Who has time to contact Musikbrauerei as an alternative. I“ve heard the rent is only 2,5 k. I don“t know if it“s possible to run the bar. But it’s worth a try. I“m in Reno so I cannot do it...
Paulus Sun 25 Aug 2019 12:31PM
I have no experince with Anomalie. it is out of gold in a west berlin 70ies party castle? But 12k seems way way to much. I do not think, that more than 500 people will come.. Is Anomalie your only option, or would you also go with Kitkat or
https://www.facebook.com/Humboldthain.Club/ or
https://www.facebook.com/zku.berlin/
https://www.facebook.com/Mensch-Meier-243748706006277/
https://www.facebook.com/heidegluehen/
https://www.facebook.com/KulturbotschaftLichtenberg
https://www.facebook.com/silentgreenkulturquartier/
https://www.facebook.com/griessmuehle/
https://kaosberlin.de/
..
Alina, also known as Universe Sun 25 Aug 2019 1:18PM
Do we have numbers from the last event at B&B? How many burners and burner friends came? and how many were "street traffic"? I have not heard of anomalie before (6 years of raving in Berlin) and have a feeling most "street traffic" there would not be of the kind that burn the same way as the Kiez community...? Radical exclusion is sometimes necessary - when it comes to clubs in Berlin. And would we have a 1000 burners there, if the whole Kiezburn was 700- with people coming from all over? I also can't help thinking that 12k is a lot of money to spend to have a BYO mini-burn? Is it just me? If we are doing this, yes, let's spend the money, but could it maybe go to a location or a club that does social work? Like Mensch Meier (next door)? Or maybe there are others? You know, people who do raves to "AFD wegbassen"? Maybe it's ok to spend money in their bar rather than having BYO then? Also, I think Owl/Holger is doing some work to get some spaces in the Haus Der Statistik? Maybe there is a way to support them - and focus more on workshops and community and less on raving? Or at least, quieter raving? :p I know I am late in the game and you guys have done a lot of legwork (thank you, awesome, tireless humans) already, but maybe just maybe there is a way to steer this awesome enterprise in a more sustainable direction?
Erin Jeavons-Fellows Mon 26 Aug 2019 7:53AM
12k is alot in comparison to other venues, including that of our previous venue B&B.
The guys from anomolie are super slow in getting back to me and its starting to concern me. Also he is a friend of mine so I dont have the confidence to negotiate teh way someone else would. Does someone else want to take over?
When we were discussing locations there was not alot of help or input from the wider community. IT basically came down to doing it at birgit again or Anomolie with the earlier conditions.... naturally we selected Anomolie. If people have other ways to help us out or connections at anomolie that can get us more leverage, please contact us.
Erin Jeavons-Fellows Mon 26 Aug 2019 7:54AM
And yes we need to consider what happens in the rare case we don't reach 12k? who pays anomolie and whats our plan to pay people back?
plom (Christian Heller) Mon 26 Aug 2019 3:15PM
Sorry for not contributing earlier to this discussion as the finance lead (was busy at CCC camp). Anyway, all this also makes me starting to feel a bit uneasy, the old deal was a comparably riskless choice, but starting into it with basically a 12k debt which we might have to overcome with heavy marketing and high ticket prices (maybe not having been involved in organizing the previous events I'm irrationally distrustful of the potential for a high number of well-paying visitors) makes the whole thing feel quite different to me, and not necessarily less commercial than a "buy drinks at the bar" event. BYOB may be an important ingredient of a "proper" burn, but I assume that the same can be said for not having to worry much about how to generate a high monetary income (!= profit). Burns obviously can be expensive, but I guess the worries about the costs can be reduced by events having grown established and popular, and trust in event conditions such as the venue. The difficulties @erinjeavonsfellows indicates about communicating with Anomalie don't give me comfort in that regard …
Bee Mon 26 Aug 2019 4:37PM
Hey! Just caught up with all this chat after being away all weekend. As I hopped in a little later I have no particular attachment to the club Anomolie and think the concerns raised around the price (which does seem rather high) and the difficulties in communication/come to an agreement. If we are thinking of alternatives I also would be drawn more to Mensch Meier as an option but without a clear idea of costs it is hard to say for sure. Should I enquire as to their price? I know they have worked with friends of mine who use the space for fundraising for Entropie festival. :)
I guess an alternative option might be to fine a more broad events space that doesn't function solely as a bar/club and would not have such a need to bring in bar money which would keep the BYO option open.
Saskia Mon 26 Aug 2019 6:10PM
After thinking about stuff over the weekend I also kinda grew more and more uncertain.
I have to say, and don't get me wrong, I got more and more upset about the behavior of the venue und start to doubt it is a good idea for me to colead an event in which I have such icky feelings.
I feel very uneasy around the fact that we confirmed several facts several times and even delivered written proof of prenegotiated terms. Now, as we have already rolled up the drums and made some noise about our amazing event, they come back and change the terms. I have no idea how negotiation and talks went @erinjeavonsfellows but I would expect at least a major apology for behaving in such an unprofessional way.
Bottom line: I am feeling increasingly more uncomfortable working with Anomalie as a venue. Not because I am afraid we'll not pull enough people (which is a considerable risk, but I feel 50/50 about it). I'd be all in for taking the risk, as long as Kiez Burn finance lead and the general opinion is that we can afford risking going in the reds a bit with this event.
I feel icky because I think good communication with the venue is key and so far the communication has been proven to be dangerously unclear.
Quentin · Thu 22 Aug 2019 9:38PM
I think it's good idea. Pre sales is the best way to get a feeling about the amount people we can gather.
It will help to decide what should be (a) art grants (b) money spent on event orga(potential drinks, deco,..) and most importantly (c) price at the door.