talk.kiezburn.org
Thu 2 May 2019 4:13PM

Tracking towards better understanding

W walto Public Seen by 36

I would like to propose we track the usage of the different online tools in a GDPR-conform way in one tool we trust won’t misuse the data.
The key argument to track better, is to understand how to facilitate more online participation in the co-creation process.

Why track

Overarching goals:

  • improve the online tools we use (website, Dreams, Talk, Realities, emails)

  • Increase the relevance of these tools to the community, particularly for new people

  • Motivate people to take action to publicize information from Talk, Realities,… via different channels

More concrete data specs:

  • better understand how we can best engage people.
    Examples: Is Facebook indeed the best way to publicize what is happening on Talk? Should we send more emails to inform people about what is happening?

  • What do people do on these platforms? How do they navigate? Which posts are checked a lot?

  • What are new people most interested in? How do they find their way to participate online? We have trouble engaging new people, so how can we do that then?

Which Tool?

First proposal

Agreed solution: Matomo

On Surveys

Some suggested we do not need to track, but can rely on surveys. I would challenge this because of two reasons:

  • just asking the people that are involved gives a very skewed picture. It is the same issue we have with a lot of things: we just end up asking the same people over and over, staying in a bubble. It usually is about engaging the people that are not very involved.

  • In addition, it is a lot more work to distill learnings about how to engage newer people with content through interviews or surveys vs. just looking at a summary of how ppl landed on the website, Talk or Realities. to be honest: won't be done.

C

Cairn (Clément)
Agree
Thu 23 Jan 2020 7:08AM

With anonymized data, I see this as a great opportunity to understand the community's behavior better and engage/empower them in the best ways possible.
Side note, being a business analyst in the default world, I'd be happy to help analyzing all this data and present it nicely to the community!

RS

Remy Schneider
Abstain
Thu 23 Jan 2020 9:49AM

I would like to know:
- who has access to this data --> is it a closed group in the Robot ministry or are we opening this up to everyone
- how do we have to notify people that we are tracking them? Does that mean that everyone will have to opt-in? Is there a clear way to do this and who will take responsiblity over this question?
- if, say, we have to have terms and conditions that detail we are using tracking - and there are questions about this - who owns/responds? Do we exclude that person?

AK

Alex Kaos
Agree
Thu 23 Jan 2020 10:14AM

I believe in Data. And if we've truly anonomized and don't collect sensative information (not even including the fact that we have no intention of selling it), then the collection is in the interest of participatory culture.

W

walto Wed 22 Jan 2020 1:57PM

@karlowalz I struggle to understand how I can engage with your arguments.
First of all, how so are the arguments used in no way valid? What is not valid about " understand how to facilitate more online participation in the co-creation process" & the more explicit goals & metrics specified in the thread and in the proposal? I spent a good amount of time trying to make it clearer. A blanket statement that they are not valid, does not contribute to making a better decision.

And then going into your arguments:
- what is passive usage? If this is meant towards people reading etc. I would argue it is super relevant. It would give a better insight on the actual relevance of Talk in engaging new people (if even to just read posts).
- you mention ways we can already track, I do not see how?
- we do not need a Datenschutzerklärung when we anonymize the data, which is what Matomo provides, apologies, that could have been clearer in the proposal.

T

Tibo Thu 23 Jan 2020 11:15AM

@remyschneider
Thanks for your concerns, maybe i can answer a little bit, but I'm not an expert on this topic though and with DSVGO it gets increasingly complicated

  • who has access to this data --> is it a closed group in the Robot ministry or are we opening this up to everyone
    => first technically everybody with root access would have access to the tracking data. i think matomo can anonymise the data immediately if set up right maybe @waldo already knows more?

  • how do we have to notify people that we are tracking them? Does that mean that everyone will have to opt-in? Is there a clear way to do this and who will take responsiblity over this question?
    => the notification would need to be right according to GDPR and our settings. There are multiple ways to set it up, anonymising the data first makes stuff much easier. But the users need to be granted several rights which also can be found in the link below. In the end the set up needs to be right according to GDPR. Mistakes in set up or handling data could happen

  • if, say, we have to have terms and conditions that detail we are using tracking - and there are questions about this - who owns/responds? Do we exclude that person?
    => mabe we need a Datenschutzbeauftragen for that

W

walto Thu 23 Jan 2020 2:16PM

Thanks for the questions @remyschneider and the clarifications from @abelstobias:
1. who has access to the data: anyone who is given a login to Matomo. This would probably require a follow-up proposal, but I would ideally allow anyone who is interested to see the data since it would be anonymous
2. We do not need to notify people that we track them, nor do we need to have terms & conditions that we track. we do not need a Datenschutzerklärung notice to agree to, given that we anonymize the data

To go a bit more technical:
- I would go into Matomo and set it up that the IP address is anonymized.
- by doing that, nobody can be identified
- since we would thus not be collecting private data, we do not need a notice according to GDPR regulations.

W

walto Thu 23 Jan 2020 11:51PM

@zachdunton are you looking after Realities? Would it be possible for you to include Matomo in Realities as well? Or is that @henrik who would look after this?

W

walto Fri 24 Jan 2020 7:17PM

Data tracked via Matomo is now anomyzed, so safe to use.

However, I need your help. I notice that I am still seeing data on our website in google analytics, but I cannot find the google analytics code on our website... Help would be appreciated. Thank you.