Mon 2 Mar 2020 1:13AM

Ticket Legal statement

W walto Public Seen by 25

Hey folks,

So we need to write a legal statement regarding the ticket purchase. I was wondering how we go about it.

The key question: how do we deal with the fact that we might need to cancel the event due to "force majeure", so for example the corona virus or whatever.

Do we have a draft of that legal statement of previous years?


Franzi Mon 9 Mar 2020 5:46AM

@Jan Thomas @Otto do you guys are working on the terms & conditions?


Remy Schneider Mon 9 Mar 2020 1:14PM

hey just wanted to resurface this --> esp. since we now have 50 confirmed cases in Berlin and lots of cities seem to be shutting down. I am not sure when we would "pull the plug" but I would assume it would be if e.g., parts of Berlin and/or Germany get quarantined - or if the health department has a strong advisory against gatherings of this kind.


Franzi Mon 9 Mar 2020 1:49PM

from a event insurance perspective - @Saskia (The Fuzzy Facilitator) and myself are looking into this right now. We also saw what nowhere sent out last night and I think we need to analyze the situation and start actively communicating about it.

The governmental advisory right now is that people shouldn't attend events with more then 1000 PAX but this will definitely change over the next 3 months.

We are also talking to clubcomission right now to see how other festivals are handling this.


Jan Thomas Tue 10 Mar 2020 10:19AM

These are the ticketing T&Cs we used in previous years. There is a line in there saying that we are not liable and don't promise refunds in case the event is canceled due to force majeure....


  • Ticket holder (“You”) voluntarily assumes all risks & danger, including personal or bodily injury or death, property loss & damage, which may occur by attending Kiez Burn 2020.

  • Ticket holder agrees that Kiez Burn e.V., associated agents & the facility owners are not responsible or liable for any damages, injuries, or claims arising from the use of this ticket and you will hold Kiez Burn e.V. harmless from any claims arising from the use of this ticket.

  • Ticket needs to be purchased with ticket holder's full legal name as per valid passport / national ID card. Legal ID matching the ticket holder's full name will be required for entry to the event.

  • Ticket holder needs to be at least 18 years old to attend the event. Children aged 17 or younger need to be accompanied by a legal guardian, and require a free kids ticket that needs to be registered as part of their legal guardian's ticket purchase.

  • No exchange or refund if event is terminated early or cancelled due to harsh weather, fire, acts of God/nature, governmental regulation or other actions beyond Kiez Burn e.V. control.

  • Taking pictures or videos in public areas is generally not allowed, to protect the privacy of our guests. The only exceptions are the special photo booth and photographers selected by the Kiez Burn e.V.. Consent is always a requirement.

  • German law applies to all legal relations between Ticket holder and event organizer Kiez Burn e.V. relating to Ticket holder's participation in the event.


Franzi Tue 10 Mar 2020 12:47PM

cool! @Saskia (The Fuzzy Facilitator) can we get them checked by clubcommission legal support if they are valid and binding? Or shall we run them buy our lawyer friend?

I am also having @Nella reviewing our T&C. She is lawyer <3


Franzi Tue 10 Mar 2020 8:26PM

@Jan Thomas @Otto @Keegan I got feedback on our terms and conditions. They are not very solid in the way they are structured.

"I took a quick look, though. The clause on force majeure is thus an unreasonable disadvantage for consumers and would therefore be null and void in the event of judicial review. A distinction must be made. In case of impossibility, the ticket price minus the costs you have already spent is to be refunded. This is how it should be regulated."

I propose we give this whole piece to a legal advisor and get it reviewed. What do you think?


Franzi Thu 12 Mar 2020 8:55AM

We are running it by club commission right now. I am also running it through a community member who is lawyer. And depending on the outcome I am thinking to re-engage the lawyer (Sebastian) who helped us with the Verein set up.


Franzi Thu 12 Mar 2020 10:12AM

So, I just came off the call with a lawyer. The way our T&Cs are structure they are not legally biding in Germany. We have two options now. Take the T&C from a bigger festival that has run theirs through a legal process (eg Fusion) or find a lawyer who helps us to set up proper T&C. @Keegan @Otto @Jan Thomas how do you wanna proceed?


Jan Thomas Thu 12 Mar 2020 11:19AM

Sorry I don't have headspace for this currently. Taking it from other festivals might be difficult, if they're not currently selling tickets. But it's probably the better starting point for now, as engaging a lawyer will be costly - and in my experience only really helps if we take one who's experienced with this exact topic. We'll only need something for the time we actually start selling tickets - which gives us a bit of time still, correct? Towards the end of March I could look at this and setup a new set of T&Cs for us based on what other german Festivals/Events do.


walto Wed 11 Mar 2020 6:58PM

Do we have a legal advisor? Maybe the club commission has tips or maybe we can copy it from other successful events such as festivals, or major conferences?